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Forum:FC:Which "side" of the Force are you on?

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Forums > Fanon Cantina > FC:Which "side" of the Force are you on?
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I was just kinda curious how people on this site aligned. So, if forced to choose, which side of the Force are you on? You're free to add your name to the section below if you want to proudly proclaim you allegiance.

AK2Ty294AK1(Guns For Hire) 14:52, May 17, 2012 (UTC)


Alignment[]

Light (5)[]

  1. As I am the Chosen One.-I'm the Chosen One 11:41, May 19, 2012 (UTC)
  2. As I am the actual Chosen One. - Brandon Rhea(talk) 22:41, May 20, 2012 (UTC)
  3. I am a spy of the Republic, and that is why my name is Darth Kermit. Im a Jedi, I tell you!--Kermit has been turned to the dark side 22:43, May 20, 2012 (UTC)
  4. As you don't have to be the Chosen One to walk the light of the path. Wink Savage1138 00:19, May 23, 2012 (UTC)
  5. If life was like KotOR, I'd be light-sided. If life was like TOR, I'd be...not quite as light-sided. Thankfully, life isn't like either game...though I'm still light.

GoodwoodDebating Society11,988 Edits 09:47, January 12, 2013 (UTC)

Dark (7)[]

  1. AK2Ty294AK1(Guns For Hire) 14:34, May 18, 2012 (UTC)
  2. -- JFJ is HIS Jedi. 00:24, May 19, 2012 (UTC)
  3. I'm Death, so I'm dark. But I'm not evil, I just enjoy my job. <3 <3 <stab stab> -Solus Talk to the Hand 01:17, May 21, 2012 (UTC)
  4. Darkside, period. Mwhahahaha (evil laugh) خمسة| (samtal) 01:53, May 21, 2012 (UTC)
  5. Sells deathsticks laden with neuropoisons. Sebolto 23:20, May 22, 2012 (UTC)
  6. If life was like a KOTOR game, I would be a dark-sided character. :(  NemethBooshi (Talk) 09:38, January 12, 2013 (UTC)
  7. Simply the dark side because of force lightning.  Care4ameatball (Talk) 02:31, February 17, 2013 (UTC)
  8. The fact that Darth Nihilus is my favorite character sums up my thoughts on the dark side. Night MandoCrest of a Thousand Tears

Comments[]

  • Are we supposed to answer this as authors/writers, or as characters from our creations? I suspect those would be two very different answers. Atarumaster88 Jedi Order (Talk page) 15:40, May 17, 2012 (UTC)
    • Refering to you the author/writer, yes. Anyone could make up both light and dark characters. AK2Ty294AK1(Guns For Hire) 14:33, May 18, 2012 (UTC)
  • Where is the neutral side? the grey path? --خمسة| (samtal) 04:50, May 18, 2012 (UTC)
    • No such thing. -MPK, Free Man 13:55, May 18, 2012 (UTC)
      • Not necessarily, individuals like Kyle Katarn, Jolee Bindo or Qui-Gon Jinn followed more of a grey path. But I thought having that option was just an easy way to weasel out of answering directly. It's almost impossible to be completely in the middle, you have to at least lean one way or the other... AK2Ty294AK1(Guns For Hire) 14:33, May 18, 2012 (UTC)
        • Impossible. There is no such thing as a "gray" side. You either use dark side powers or you don't. What you are asking/saying relates to philosophy, not the Force itself or its application.-I'm the Chosen One 11:41, May 19, 2012 (UTC)
          • So you're saying that simply by using a Dark Side power, you are "on the Dark Side"? No offense... but that sounds like a Jedi interpretation... AK2Ty294AK1(Guns For Hire) 14:07, May 22, 2012 (UTC)
            • Well, the Jedi are the good guys. The vast majority of dark side powers are used to harm or kill others (out of the 24 listed dark powers on wookieepedia, approximately five have other applications), and it is proven that the use of dark powers tends to screw with the user's head. So yes, generally speaking, users of dark powers tend to be dark-siders. And regarding the "gray Jedi" mentioned above, both Qui-Gon and Jolee were really only "gray" in the sense that they didn't have good relationships with the Jedi Council, nothing to do with choice of powers. -MPK, Free Man 15:13, May 22, 2012 (UTC)
              • I wouldn't really consider Jedi good guys... I think they're idiots (and let's just say they aren't well-loved among my cicle of online friends). Of course, the Sith are monsters, no doubts there... That's why I tend to be anti-forceuser. But I think a good example of "grey" forceusers would be both Katarn and his apprentice Jaden Korr, who used Dark Side powers yet weren't necessarily corrupted by them (I think corruption is just a result of the user being weak and undisiplined, as the Sith and Dark Jedi are.)AK2Ty294AK1(Guns For Hire) 02:46, May 26, 2012 (UTC)
                • A whole faction is filled with idiots? Blanket statements like that are bad. The simple fact is the Jedi are good guys because they don't kill for fun or for gain, they strive to defend others (bad guys don't really do that). Again, you are talking about philosophy. There is no gray side to the Force, there are gray philosophies. The question you are asked here is if one supports the use of the Force to kill/subvert/torture or not. You did not ask whether our philosophy is oriented to a pacifist stance or militant. Philosophy and the Force are two different things.-I'm the Chosen One 03:02, May 26, 2012 (UTC)
                  • "A whole faction is filled with idiots? Blanket statements like that are bad." I don't know, they couldn't see that Palpatine was a Sith Lord the whole time, even their "Grand Master" couldn't see it. "Dark side clouds everything" my a**.--Josh Benderщ(ﾟДﾟщ) 04:52, May 26, 2012 (UTC)
                    • Even so, those 1,000 guys do not make up the entire 25,000 year history of the Order. Besides, I thought ol' Palpatine was this all-powerful super being that is sooo bad a**. Also, blind=/=idiotic. I'm the Chosen One 05:21, May 26, 2012 (UTC)
                      • If you're saying simply that you cannot be somewhere between the Light and Dark, I guess you may have somewhat of a point, although I don't know then what you'd consider a person who uses both "Light" and "Dark" powers... But as for whether or not using Dark Side powers make you evil... well: "Remember: abilities are not inherently good or evil, it's how you use them." - Kyle Katarn. "The Force is... ...in reality, a weapon, to empower the worthy." - Desann. I think the force is a weapon, albiet a dangerous one, but one that can be brought under one's own control. But most Forceusers (especially Dark-Siders) tend to be undisiplined, selfish brats who think they're gifted and special. They all pretty much wind up being slaves to their respective side of the Force. AK2Ty294AK1(Guns For Hire) 21:19, May 26, 2012 (UTC)
                    • A person that uses Dark Side powers at all is, for all intents and purposes, a Dark Sider. On another note, Kyle Katarn, and this may shock you, is wrong. One cannot justify the use of Force affliction or Force choke in a way that would be not evil. Dark Side automatically makes you evil because of the intent behind the powers and its ability to corrupt a person. Desann is wrong in the sense that the Force is not to be a tool of anybody nor does it choose a being. Finally, the idea that the Force can be "controlled" or brought to heel is a dark side ideology that is inherently flawed and one that brought the Sith into being. That is like saying you can control the force of nature.-I'm the Chosen One 22:11, May 26, 2012 (UTC)

(resent indent) Since Kyle Katarn and Jaden Korr are being mentioned, let’s take a look at how it was presented in Jedi Knight: Jedi Academy. When you chose a dark side power to use, you were warned by Luke Skywalker that you also had to choose light side powers or else you would fall to the dark side. There was no “use this cautiously” or “use these sparingly” warnings. There were “shape it up or you will turn to the dark side” warnings. Having equal light side and dark sided powers in that game balanced you out, but it didn’t mean you were still good or walking a middle path. In a way, can you walk a middle path if that game is what we’re taking as gospel? Yes, in the sense that you have to constantly make sure that you don’t even slightly tip towards the dark side—because once you start down the dark path, it will forever dominate your destiny (redemption is hard).

That said, it doesn’t mean your mental state is goodness vs. evilness is in balance, at least not in any stable way. When you use a light side power, you’re using inherently good powers. If you use a dark side power, you’re using inherently evil power. You’re doing evil things and good things. They’re not “shades of grey,” they actually are good and evil. Either you’re good, you struggle between the two, or you’re evil.

That’s the difference between what a lot of people think about Grey Jedi, and people like Kyle Katarn or Jolee Bindo. Kyle Katarn and Jolee Bindo didn’t use dark side powers so much as they used unorthodox methods through other means. They were still good, they walked the path of the light. They just didn’t hold to traditional Jedi doctrine.

Now let’s take all of canon. Our own personal interpretations aside, the Force is inherently good, because the Force is to Star Wars as God is to real-world religion—hence the will of the Force. In-universe, the Potentium view of the Force being neutral and our actions determining whether something is light or dark is a fringe theory, and a false one at that. It’s canonically false, that’s not just me saying that.

So in a way, both ITCO and Ty are correct. There is no grey side to the Force. There’s a light side and a dark side, and the Force as a whole is inherently good. If you’re a religious person, then a good point of comparison could be to say that Heaven is good and Hell is bad, but the universe as a whole is run by Heaven so, therefore, the universe is inherently good. God created evil but is still the embodiment of good, etc. You can be a grey person, though, but that doesn’t actually make you a truly balanced person in a stable sense—you’re about as balanced as someone walking a tightrope a thousand feet in the air. If you use a dark side power, though, you are using an inherently evil power. That’s fact.

As for the Jedi, they are the good guys and, as a whole, they’re not idiots. There’s a 25,000 year history to the Jedi Order, so looking just at Lucas’ terrible writing from the prequels and saying “Jedi are idiots” makes very little sense. I know fan fic writers also like to say that Revan and Malak were right in defying the Jedi Council, but the Council wasn’t wrong—they didn’t know the full extent of the conflict they were entering into. The Council wasn’t stupid to say that. Enter the Sith Emperor. etc. etc. etc.

Were the Jedi always right? Of course not. That doesn’t mean they weren’t good, though. It just means the end doesn’t always justify the means, whereas we in the real world often think it does.

End transmission. - Brandon Rhea(talk) 23:24, May 26, 2012 (UTC)

    • To blame George Lucas about the "bad writing" of the prequels is to complain about the one time he actually potrayed the Jedi realistically. There is no way, except for the efforts of goody-goody story-writers, that a faction as self-contradictory and squimish as the Jedi would last that long, especially considering how many other groups tried to stamp them out. It pretty much is always a matter of luck that the Light Side seems to win, since the realistically would lose in just about every situation they're put in.

I also do believe the ends justify the means... at least most of the time. Using violence isn't evil, it's WHY you use it and WHO you use it against that makes it evil or not, IMO. Thus, I can't see anything evil with Force Choking a murderous enemy to death, especially if they've already killed people you know and care about. Even on top of that, Force Choking is actually just an extention of Force Push and Pull (or any form of telekenetic ability) but applied on a person.

Regardless, I still maintain my position that I'd rather be non-Force-sensative, rather than deal with all the problems that come with it (whether from the Force itself, or the stupid 'Orders' that follow it).

I actually kinda figured a debate like this would be sparked from this poll. I seem to have a knack for starting controversial discussions. Tongue AK2Ty294AK1(Guns For Hire) 19:47, May 27, 2012 (UTC)

  • Last rebuttal. You say an organization such as this could not last as long as it did without the help of writers...well I ask you this, how does Buddhism survive for 4 thousand years despite having no militant branch to defend itself from persecution? Being an offensive juggernaut doesn't always mean you have the advantage. In universe it is fairly clear why the Jedi always win and it has nothing to do with luck. Choking a person regardless of what they have done is wrong since applying the "eye for an eye" philosophy makes you no better than the murderer you just killed. You are committing the exact same crime that said evil person had done before. Ergo you are just as evil as that person (Batman is a good example).-I'm the Chosen One 01:34, May 28, 2012 (UTC)

Look at yourselves. What are you doing? You're writing fairly longish dissertations on the workings of a philosophy in a universe which does not exist. We don't know the exact workings of it, its not real - the philosophy of the Jedi changes on whether the writer is GL, BioWare, Traviss, or User:12783512876351. We can't pin it down, it's an idea. I mean, what are we, a bunch of sad little nerds arguing over a sad little universe, most of which we don't like? It's not like we're fanfic-ers.

...

...Oh. -Solus Talk to the Hand 20:16, May 27, 2012 (UTC)

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